I found myself surprisingly sympathetic to the blokes quoted in this Guardian story about Ukrainian draft dodgers, even though I’d like to think I wouldn’t join them. I’m not especially brave or looking to get flash-fried in an armoured vehicle. But sometimes you just gotta, you know, shoot a few fascists to make them go away. Also, unlike these guys, I’m at the back end of my innings and I figure a rogue melanoma is coming for me sooner rather than later so it’s not like I have a whole life to preserve.
The autumn cannot arrive soon enough for Dmytro, when his handlers have promised to get him out of Ukraine.
For the past month, the 31-year-old photographer from Kharkiv, Ukraine’s second-largest city, has been holed up in his flat, rarely stepping outside, to avoid being conscripted into the army. “I want to leave the country. My mind can’t take being trapped here any more,” Dmytro said.
Since the start of the war, thousands of Ukrainian men have illegally crossed the Ukrainian border to dodge conscription, despite a nationwide ban prohibiting men between the ages of 18 and 60 from leaving.
Attempts to flee the country are expected to increase after Ukraine’s recent adoption of new sweeping mobilisation measures, which allow the military to call up more soldiers and impose stricter penalties for draft evasion.
“I never thought about leaving until the mobilisation laws were introduced. But I can’t stay in my flat forever,” Dmytro said.
Through friends who had already fled, Dmytro obtained contacts and approached individuals online promising to facilitate his escape for a hefty fee, starting from €8,000 (£6,800).
“I am not made for war. I can’t kill people, even if they are Russians. I won’t last long on the front … I want to build a family and see the world. I am not ready to die,” he said.
The piece goes on to quote another four or five drafter evaders. They’re not conscientious objectors. They’re just being honest, I guess. It’s not for them. I sort of admire the self-awareness even as I deplore the… what? Is it cowardice? Really? That’s a convenient accusation to level against someone who has to face a reality that you don’t. I suppose the only ones who can legit make that call are the men and women who volunteered to fight for them, meant thousands of whom have already given up their lives or their limbs to hold off Putin’s hordes.
And complicating the moral equation? What do you think of Russians who fled their country to avoid the draft? Not heroes, I guess, but not cowards either.
"What a toxic mess war makes of us all." Indeed. I saw this piece, too. It made me wonder if Ukraine has a "conscientious objector" slot, like the US military has/had. In the Second World War, they generally placed those people in medical positions. This is not to say they avoided danger—see Desmond Doss, a medic who was awarded the Medal of Honor.
Ukraine may be using the Soviet model, which would allow for no such thing. But I don't know. I'd certainly think that the families of those who went and now occupy a tidy plot of real estate may feel less kindly to these people, but they may have sympathy for them, too. Like everything human related, it's complicated.
Often when we think of the Second World War we think of a stoic and heroic generation who went off without complaint to face the Germans and the Japanese. This is completely untrue upon a close study of the actual data. There were hundreds of thousands on the Allied side who were charged with desertion or draft evasion, because everyone knew you stood a great chance of being maimed or wounded upon contact.
By 1945 the problem was so acute that the US Army combed through service support units in Europe and made "instant infantrymen" out of guys who lingered with supply, etc. units in the rear, or had gotten into trouble. Back in the States, anyone who left school early (my Grandpa), was subject to an immediate callup for conscription, followed by six weeks of training and a Liberty ship shortly thereafter.
The draft boards didn't care. My other grandpa, a former felon with two kids, got his slip, too. My Great Grandpa, a veteran of the Great War and at the upper limit of conscription age, got a slip as well. This was the reality of a world at war.
What the Guardian descibes is hardly exceptional, therefore. I'd imagine that if caught, these people will suffer the same fate as in the past. Arrest, processing, and then a trip to the front anyway. If they escape, it will also go as in the past. They'll watch the slaughter from afar, and, as with all wars, this one will eventually end. They will return home, and for the rest of their lives they'll be looking over their shoulder in fear of belated prosecution. In addition, they'll feel a weird mixture of shame and queasy relief when they see some guy or gal short an appendage or two, and they'll change the subject or lie when someone asks what they did in the war.
Everyone pays a price, even these folks. It's like the observation that it's more work to stay out of work, rather than just doing the damn thing. My family picked up the tomahawk, because that's what they did from time out of mind. Others, without that same tradition, did not.
As the author noted, it's a toxic mess, and one I'd gladly see end as part of the human condition. But, you can wish all you want, and as long as we stay biologically linked to the ancestors, there will be a reason to kill your neighbor.
It's a damn sorrow, the whole mess. And then after the fighting is done, it's not done. The survivors carry the war around for the rest of their days, and so do the families.
The pieces of garbage who start wars for fire and glory? If they don't die in a smelly bunker, they get a place in some stupid history book, zero price paid.
You don't have to be in Ukraine to be fighting fascists these days, and even if you are fighting some elements of the Ukranian forces you are fighting fascists . I get the point though - I'm not sure how willing to fight a foreign invader who had arrived in Australia I would be. Given how we behave towards the increasingly despotic and fascist USA with its bases, spying tech, aircraft located here I am not sure how willing I would be defending what our politicians declare 'Australian values'.
Outright fascist units like Azov have actually started balking at orders to advance, so now they are throwing draftees with three days of training into advances. They just die immediately to Russian artillery, drones, and machineguns.
The key difference between the Ukrainian draft dodgers and the Russians is that the Russians are probably being judged more kindly for refusing to take part in an invasion, while the Ukrainian ones are being looked at askance for not sticking around to defend their homeland from said invasion. Doesn't make the horror of war any less horrible if you're on the defending side rather than the invading one though.
All of the Russians fighting in Ukraine are volunteers. Russians who are doing their one year mandatory draft stint are posted elsewhere in Russia to free up volunteer contract soldiers.
Are they volunteers, or "volunteers"? I'm sure I read somewhere that Russia's jails were being emptied by giving prisoners the option to "volunteer" for Army duty...
The Wagner Group PMC was allowed to recruit from jails, but, after its owner, Yevgeny Prigozhin had his psychotic break and tried to stage a coup, Wagner was folded into the Russian Army. Wagner group members, including the felons, were given the option to muster out if they wished.
In all honesty, it is likely better for the military if the ones that really don't want to fight, don't, I think.
I say this as someone who has no illusions about surviving a war. I am not one of the lucky ones. If I didn't have bad luck, I would have no luck at all. I would die. I would have died in my 20s and I sure as fuck would die now in my 50s. I'd still go, I think. But I'll never have to test that.
Interesting quandary. I'm over that hill as well but I did my bit earlier on, and very fortunately missed any conflicts. Are we now passed handing out white feathers? I'm not sure how I would feel if Oz was directly and immediately involved in a conflict - would I insist my sons head off to war? And daughters too these days? I hope I never have to find out where I stand on that one.
"What a toxic mess war makes of us all." Indeed. I saw this piece, too. It made me wonder if Ukraine has a "conscientious objector" slot, like the US military has/had. In the Second World War, they generally placed those people in medical positions. This is not to say they avoided danger—see Desmond Doss, a medic who was awarded the Medal of Honor.
Ukraine may be using the Soviet model, which would allow for no such thing. But I don't know. I'd certainly think that the families of those who went and now occupy a tidy plot of real estate may feel less kindly to these people, but they may have sympathy for them, too. Like everything human related, it's complicated.
Often when we think of the Second World War we think of a stoic and heroic generation who went off without complaint to face the Germans and the Japanese. This is completely untrue upon a close study of the actual data. There were hundreds of thousands on the Allied side who were charged with desertion or draft evasion, because everyone knew you stood a great chance of being maimed or wounded upon contact.
By 1945 the problem was so acute that the US Army combed through service support units in Europe and made "instant infantrymen" out of guys who lingered with supply, etc. units in the rear, or had gotten into trouble. Back in the States, anyone who left school early (my Grandpa), was subject to an immediate callup for conscription, followed by six weeks of training and a Liberty ship shortly thereafter.
The draft boards didn't care. My other grandpa, a former felon with two kids, got his slip, too. My Great Grandpa, a veteran of the Great War and at the upper limit of conscription age, got a slip as well. This was the reality of a world at war.
What the Guardian descibes is hardly exceptional, therefore. I'd imagine that if caught, these people will suffer the same fate as in the past. Arrest, processing, and then a trip to the front anyway. If they escape, it will also go as in the past. They'll watch the slaughter from afar, and, as with all wars, this one will eventually end. They will return home, and for the rest of their lives they'll be looking over their shoulder in fear of belated prosecution. In addition, they'll feel a weird mixture of shame and queasy relief when they see some guy or gal short an appendage or two, and they'll change the subject or lie when someone asks what they did in the war.
Everyone pays a price, even these folks. It's like the observation that it's more work to stay out of work, rather than just doing the damn thing. My family picked up the tomahawk, because that's what they did from time out of mind. Others, without that same tradition, did not.
As the author noted, it's a toxic mess, and one I'd gladly see end as part of the human condition. But, you can wish all you want, and as long as we stay biologically linked to the ancestors, there will be a reason to kill your neighbor.
It's a damn sorrow, the whole mess. And then after the fighting is done, it's not done. The survivors carry the war around for the rest of their days, and so do the families.
The pieces of garbage who start wars for fire and glory? If they don't die in a smelly bunker, they get a place in some stupid history book, zero price paid.
It is what it is.
You don't have to be in Ukraine to be fighting fascists these days, and even if you are fighting some elements of the Ukranian forces you are fighting fascists . I get the point though - I'm not sure how willing to fight a foreign invader who had arrived in Australia I would be. Given how we behave towards the increasingly despotic and fascist USA with its bases, spying tech, aircraft located here I am not sure how willing I would be defending what our politicians declare 'Australian values'.
Outright fascist units like Azov have actually started balking at orders to advance, so now they are throwing draftees with three days of training into advances. They just die immediately to Russian artillery, drones, and machineguns.
The key difference between the Ukrainian draft dodgers and the Russians is that the Russians are probably being judged more kindly for refusing to take part in an invasion, while the Ukrainian ones are being looked at askance for not sticking around to defend their homeland from said invasion. Doesn't make the horror of war any less horrible if you're on the defending side rather than the invading one though.
All of the Russians fighting in Ukraine are volunteers. Russians who are doing their one year mandatory draft stint are posted elsewhere in Russia to free up volunteer contract soldiers.
Are they volunteers, or "volunteers"? I'm sure I read somewhere that Russia's jails were being emptied by giving prisoners the option to "volunteer" for Army duty...
They are volunteers, period.
The Wagner Group PMC was allowed to recruit from jails, but, after its owner, Yevgeny Prigozhin had his psychotic break and tried to stage a coup, Wagner was folded into the Russian Army. Wagner group members, including the felons, were given the option to muster out if they wished.
“People never lie so much as after a hunt, during a war, or before an election.”
― Otto von Bismarck
the ABC news did a piece as well from the Russian defector viewpoint - interesting how they came so close together. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-07-02/how-russian-soldiers-escaped-from-front-lines-in-ukraine/103953886
Quite a few times in the last few weeks i've caught myself humming/whistling Dylan's Masters of War.
In all honesty, it is likely better for the military if the ones that really don't want to fight, don't, I think.
I say this as someone who has no illusions about surviving a war. I am not one of the lucky ones. If I didn't have bad luck, I would have no luck at all. I would die. I would have died in my 20s and I sure as fuck would die now in my 50s. I'd still go, I think. But I'll never have to test that.
Interesting quandary. I'm over that hill as well but I did my bit earlier on, and very fortunately missed any conflicts. Are we now passed handing out white feathers? I'm not sure how I would feel if Oz was directly and immediately involved in a conflict - would I insist my sons head off to war? And daughters too these days? I hope I never have to find out where I stand on that one.